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What did they say instead of Ha Lachma Anya in Temple times?
Parashat Metzora+HagadolPesach/PassoverBeginners' Seder AdviceWhy do we quote the pasuk from Pesach Sheni for Korech?why don't we say “kol dichfin” before kidushWill Korech move to the end of the Seder in the future?Kol Dichfin, Why So Hesitant?What kind of seder did a non-oleh l'regel have during the time of the Bais Hamikdash (and for that matter, the entire 40 years in the desert)?Why in הא לחמא עניא do we invite people to come to our seder table while the seder is going on?The Number of Rabbinic MitzvotDoes my uncircumcised friend still needs to be circumcised in order to join the meal for Pesach?Can you say the Birkas Hagomel on Shabbos or Pesach?
They couldn't have said "Let all who are hungry come and eat", because only those who were registered for the Pesach could eat at the Seder.
Did they say it (or something like it) earlier (on Erev Pesach) to invite people to join the Korban? If not, when and why was the line added to the Haggadah?
passover passover-seder-hagada korban-pesach
asked Apr 4 at 6:54
Daniel KaganDaniel Kagan
37117
add a comment |
They couldn't have said "Let all who are hungry come and eat", because only those who were registered for the Pesach could eat at the Seder.
Did they say it (or something like it) earlier (on Erev Pesach) to invite people to join the Korban? If not, when and why was the line added to the Haggadah?
passover passover-seder-hagada korban-pesach
asked Apr 4 at 6:54
Daniel KaganDaniel Kagan
37117
You assume there was a unified version of the Haggada at that times, I seriously doubt it. Ha Lachmah isn't the essential part of it so its inclusion was optional. Like people were just invinting each other saying "let's eat" and a thousand years later that became a part of the formula.
– Al Berko
Apr 4 at 17:42
add a comment |
They couldn't have said "Let all who are hungry come and eat", because only those who were registered for the Pesach could eat at the Seder.
Did they say it (or something like it) earlier (on Erev Pesach) to invite people to join the Korban? If not, when and why was the line added to the Haggadah?
passover passover-seder-hagada korban-pesach
asked Apr 4 at 6:54
Daniel KaganDaniel Kagan
37117
They couldn't have said "Let all who are hungry come and eat", because only those who were registered for the Pesach could eat at the Seder.
Did they say it (or something like it) earlier (on Erev Pesach) to invite people to join the Korban? If not, when and why was the line added to the Haggadah?
passover passover-seder-hagada korban-pesach
passover passover-seder-hagada korban-pesach
asked Apr 4 at 6:54
Daniel KaganDaniel Kagan
37117
asked Apr 4 at 6:54
Daniel KaganDaniel Kagan
37117
asked Apr 4 at 6:54
Daniel KaganDaniel Kagan
37117
asked Apr 4 at 6:54
Daniel KaganDaniel Kagan
37117
asked Apr 4 at 6:54
Daniel KaganDaniel Kagan
37117
37117
You assume there was a unified version of the Haggada at that times, I seriously doubt it. Ha Lachmah isn't the essential part of it so its inclusion was optional. Like people were just invinting each other saying "let's eat" and a thousand years later that became a part of the formula.
– Al Berko
Apr 4 at 17:42
add a comment |
You assume there was a unified version of the Haggada at that times, I seriously doubt it. Ha Lachmah isn't the essential part of it so its inclusion was optional. Like people were just invinting each other saying "let's eat" and a thousand years later that became a part of the formula.
– Al Berko
Apr 4 at 17:42
You assume there was a unified version of the Haggada at that times, I seriously doubt it. Ha Lachmah isn't the essential part of it so its inclusion was optional. Like people were just invinting each other saying "let's eat" and a thousand years later that became a part of the formula.
– Al Berko
Apr 4 at 17:42
You assume there was a unified version of the Haggada at that times, I seriously doubt it. Ha Lachmah isn't the essential part of it so its inclusion was optional. Like people were just invinting each other saying "let's eat" and a thousand years later that became a part of the formula.
– Al Berko
Apr 4 at 17:42
add a comment |
1 Answer
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(Pesudo)-Malbim in Midrash Haggadah advances the following theory.
This passage originated in the Babylonian Exile (and thus is in Aramaic) and was recited on the afternoon before Pesach. It was meant as an invitation to paupers to join one's seder that evening, and consisted of the phrases:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל. הָשַּׁתָּא הָכָא, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּאַרְעָא דְיִשְׂרָאֵל.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat [it later]. This year we are here, next year in Israel.
After many Jews returned to Israel, the text was still recited there on erev pesach (as you suggested) and was changed to add a reference to the korban pesach and to make the final line more relevant:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל, כָּל דִצְרִיךְ יֵיתֵי וְיִפְסַח. הָשַּׁתָּא עַבְדֵי, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּנֵי חוֹרִין.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat. Whoever needs, let him join in our korban pesach. This year we are slaves, next year free people.
Our text combines both versions, and is recited at the start of the seder as a commemoration of the old practice to recite it on erev pesach.
He also presents an alternative theory, that this paragraph was always recited at the start of the seder (rather than on erev pesach) and was meant to encourage the children to come to the table for the start of the proceedings.
According to this approach, the phrase "Whoever needs, let him join in the korban pesach" is directed at the household, and is to be understood as "Whoever needs to eat from this Pesach [because he is part of the registered group] let him come and do so [now, as the seder is starting]".
answered Apr 4 at 8:07
Joel KJoel K
14.8k22897
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
(Pesudo)-Malbim in Midrash Haggadah advances the following theory.
This passage originated in the Babylonian Exile (and thus is in Aramaic) and was recited on the afternoon before Pesach. It was meant as an invitation to paupers to join one's seder that evening, and consisted of the phrases:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל. הָשַּׁתָּא הָכָא, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּאַרְעָא דְיִשְׂרָאֵל.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat [it later]. This year we are here, next year in Israel.
After many Jews returned to Israel, the text was still recited there on erev pesach (as you suggested) and was changed to add a reference to the korban pesach and to make the final line more relevant:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל, כָּל דִצְרִיךְ יֵיתֵי וְיִפְסַח. הָשַּׁתָּא עַבְדֵי, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּנֵי חוֹרִין.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat. Whoever needs, let him join in our korban pesach. This year we are slaves, next year free people.
Our text combines both versions, and is recited at the start of the seder as a commemoration of the old practice to recite it on erev pesach.
He also presents an alternative theory, that this paragraph was always recited at the start of the seder (rather than on erev pesach) and was meant to encourage the children to come to the table for the start of the proceedings.
According to this approach, the phrase "Whoever needs, let him join in the korban pesach" is directed at the household, and is to be understood as "Whoever needs to eat from this Pesach [because he is part of the registered group] let him come and do so [now, as the seder is starting]".
answered Apr 4 at 8:07
Joel KJoel K
14.8k22897
add a comment |
(Pesudo)-Malbim in Midrash Haggadah advances the following theory.
This passage originated in the Babylonian Exile (and thus is in Aramaic) and was recited on the afternoon before Pesach. It was meant as an invitation to paupers to join one's seder that evening, and consisted of the phrases:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל. הָשַּׁתָּא הָכָא, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּאַרְעָא דְיִשְׂרָאֵל.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat [it later]. This year we are here, next year in Israel.
After many Jews returned to Israel, the text was still recited there on erev pesach (as you suggested) and was changed to add a reference to the korban pesach and to make the final line more relevant:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל, כָּל דִצְרִיךְ יֵיתֵי וְיִפְסַח. הָשַּׁתָּא עַבְדֵי, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּנֵי חוֹרִין.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat. Whoever needs, let him join in our korban pesach. This year we are slaves, next year free people.
Our text combines both versions, and is recited at the start of the seder as a commemoration of the old practice to recite it on erev pesach.
He also presents an alternative theory, that this paragraph was always recited at the start of the seder (rather than on erev pesach) and was meant to encourage the children to come to the table for the start of the proceedings.
According to this approach, the phrase "Whoever needs, let him join in the korban pesach" is directed at the household, and is to be understood as "Whoever needs to eat from this Pesach [because he is part of the registered group] let him come and do so [now, as the seder is starting]".
answered Apr 4 at 8:07
Joel KJoel K
14.8k22897
add a comment |
(Pesudo)-Malbim in Midrash Haggadah advances the following theory.
This passage originated in the Babylonian Exile (and thus is in Aramaic) and was recited on the afternoon before Pesach. It was meant as an invitation to paupers to join one's seder that evening, and consisted of the phrases:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל. הָשַּׁתָּא הָכָא, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּאַרְעָא דְיִשְׂרָאֵל.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat [it later]. This year we are here, next year in Israel.
After many Jews returned to Israel, the text was still recited there on erev pesach (as you suggested) and was changed to add a reference to the korban pesach and to make the final line more relevant:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל, כָּל דִצְרִיךְ יֵיתֵי וְיִפְסַח. הָשַּׁתָּא עַבְדֵי, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּנֵי חוֹרִין.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat. Whoever needs, let him join in our korban pesach. This year we are slaves, next year free people.
Our text combines both versions, and is recited at the start of the seder as a commemoration of the old practice to recite it on erev pesach.
He also presents an alternative theory, that this paragraph was always recited at the start of the seder (rather than on erev pesach) and was meant to encourage the children to come to the table for the start of the proceedings.
According to this approach, the phrase "Whoever needs, let him join in the korban pesach" is directed at the household, and is to be understood as "Whoever needs to eat from this Pesach [because he is part of the registered group] let him come and do so [now, as the seder is starting]".
answered Apr 4 at 8:07
Joel KJoel K
14.8k22897
(Pesudo)-Malbim in Midrash Haggadah advances the following theory.
This passage originated in the Babylonian Exile (and thus is in Aramaic) and was recited on the afternoon before Pesach. It was meant as an invitation to paupers to join one's seder that evening, and consisted of the phrases:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל. הָשַּׁתָּא הָכָא, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּאַרְעָא דְיִשְׂרָאֵל.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat [it later]. This year we are here, next year in Israel.
After many Jews returned to Israel, the text was still recited there on erev pesach (as you suggested) and was changed to add a reference to the korban pesach and to make the final line more relevant:
הָא לַחְמָא עַנְיָא דִּי אֲכָלוּ אַבְהָתָנָא בְאַרְעָא דְמִצְרָיִם. כָּל דִכְפִין יֵיתֵי וְיֵיכֹל, כָּל דִצְרִיךְ יֵיתֵי וְיִפְסַח. הָשַּׁתָּא עַבְדֵי, לְשָׁנָה הַבָּאָה בְּנֵי חוֹרִין.
This is the bread of affliction that our forefathers ate in Egypt. Whoever is hungry let him come and eat. Whoever needs, let him join in our korban pesach. This year we are slaves, next year free people.
Our text combines both versions, and is recited at the start of the seder as a commemoration of the old practice to recite it on erev pesach.
He also presents an alternative theory, that this paragraph was always recited at the start of the seder (rather than on erev pesach) and was meant to encourage the children to come to the table for the start of the proceedings.
According to this approach, the phrase "Whoever needs, let him join in the korban pesach" is directed at the household, and is to be understood as "Whoever needs to eat from this Pesach [because he is part of the registered group] let him come and do so [now, as the seder is starting]".
answered Apr 4 at 8:07
Joel KJoel K
14.8k22897
edited Apr 4 at 15:39
answered Apr 4 at 8:07
Joel KJoel K
14.8k22897
answered Apr 4 at 8:07
Joel KJoel K
14.8k22897
answered Apr 4 at 8:07
Joel KJoel K
14.8k22897
14.8k22897
add a comment |
add a comment |
You assume there was a unified version of the Haggada at that times, I seriously doubt it. Ha Lachmah isn't the essential part of it so its inclusion was optional. Like people were just invinting each other saying "let's eat" and a thousand years later that became a part of the formula.
– Al Berko
Apr 4 at 17:42